Slashdot Once More...

[DijiTao]

Let me put it bluntly:

Attention GP2X Distributors: You are criminals.

When I bought the GP2X I expected it to comply with the GPL, when GPH didn’t at first I was annoyed but expected the situation to be resolved in a matter of days, maybe even a month. It is fair to believe you though the same thing as well. It has now become blatantly obvious that GPH has little to no intention or motivation to comply with the GPL and by you continuing to sell the device you are not only encouraging them, but are just as guilty as they are.

STOP SELLING THE GP2X UNTIL GPH COMPLIES WITH THE GPL.

 

[shrubberyrobbery]

this is all getting a bit unsettling.

GPH are worried about chinese clones? so what? that's the WHOLE POINT of opensource: so that OTHERS can benefit from it and build on it. It's SUPPOSED to be the opposite of the 'control-freak' tendancies of the typical capitalist setup.

I can see their point - wanting to maximise the profit on their investment, but they are NOT playing fair. If I had a project that I built, using existing GPL code, and then I delayed on releasing my source because I didn't want anyone else to profit from it (even though I am profiting from the efforts of OTHERS), well, then I'm going against the whole spirit of the license.

Perhaps GPH really aren't aware of the size of the implications of what they are doing? Obviously they are not interested either way... with their "I don't want to".

I'm now having doubts about developing anything for the platform.

Grrr. it's so frustrating! :angry:

 

[Paradox]

i guess people should stop selling it, until GPH comply, or at least stop advertising that its open source..

 

[GeminiDomino]

i guess people should stop selling it, until GPH comply, or at least stop advertising that its open source..

​

Depending on local laws, the former action may be the one they have to do. I'm pretty sure that most Berne Convention countries have something called "contributory infringement" (I know for a fact that the US and Australia do) which means you can get pinched for selling "pirate" intellectual property, even if you're not the one who pirated it, which is essentially what the GP2X is at this point.

 

[Muncher666]

I've noticed that there is a lot of freaking out going on here. As a consumer, I am annoyed that the device isn't fully compliant, but I think it's just plain stupid to want them to stop selling it. I am enjoying my GP2x, gpl compliance aside, and I'd be pissed (assuming I wanted one and was intending to buy one, I've already got one) if people stopped selling it BEFORE some sort of legal injunction over this.

New reply from dignsys:

"Dear Sir.

No, I mean, We have plan to release every one or two month.
Because, we are small and we do not have own web server, english and korean site is same.
So, we must send the file to our web administration company and they update the file.
Frankly speaking, We are spend many time and money to get available space on our web server to release the source.
whenever we request new update, we must give some charge to them too.

The version of source on our web is the source that release 11. 2005."

Calm down guys. This will be sorted (I'm an optimist), and I honestly think that the device hasn't really been out long enough to get this upset about it yet.

Allan.

EDIT: My reply:

"Hi there.

That's fine, although we still want the source code available. I understand that you have no wish to spend money unnecessarily, but I (among many, many others) are willing to host it for free. We would even be willing for you to link to us on your site, so that people could directly download the source code this way.

Allan."

 

[AcidiC]

Calm down guys. This will be sorted (I'm an optimist), and I honestly think that the device hasn't really been out long enough to get this upset about it yet.

Yeah, I suppose we have been a bit tough on them, poor little Koreans (reading engrish always gets me in a happy mood)

 

[shrubberyrobbery]

I've noticed that there is a lot of freaking out going on here. As a consumer, I am annoyed that the device isn't fully compliant, but I think it's just plain stupid to want them to stop selling it.

​

I don't think you get the seriousness of it.

Imagine for a second that all the developers who are making software for this gp2x, and are ESSENTIAL to its survival, decide to WITHHOLD all of their own projects, because effectively gph are profitting from THEIR unpaid efforts, and basically taking the p*ss.

Imagine an EMPTY downloads section on www.gp32x.de

Actually that's not such a bad idea. Any devs around who are unhappy and would like to withdraw their releases until gph play ball?

In fact, lets put that the other way, are there any devs out there who are still quite happy for gph to profit from their unpaid efforts, whilst breaking the opensource spirit in which their work is done?

 

[bacteria]

Seems to me that many people seem to want the GP2x to die by focussing on this issue. Why? It is impossible in the modern world to not violate copyright in some form - ever read a mate's magazine? Ever kept a tv program for more than 28 days? Are you using mp3's? Do you watch a dvd with your partner? DO YOU USE ROMS FOR EMULATION (eg on GP2x?). Do you use the same cd in the car as your stereo?? etc, etc. All these violate copyright/broadcast rights. Let's not throw bricks when living in a greenhouse, as the saying goes.

Seems to me that the GP2x has to evolve and improve, and it can't do that if people keep trying to bring them to their knees and/or stop distributers from selling the GP2x by invoking fear in the community, and members from threatening not to develop for the system.

Have I missed the point, or do I just see the GP2x potentially dying by (un)popular support from the minority, rather than being the best thing out there for portable systems?? At best, such comments will hinder the GP2x's progress, which surely none of us want ?!

 

[Paradox]

aww AcidiC, me too XD poor little koreans haha *tickles the koreans* so cute..

anyway, i think its crap that they talk about not having enough space to host a few MB files, once one person downloads it it will be put on the file archive and on numerous other sites, so its not like their site will be taken down from everyone downloading it..maybe you should let them know that they can release it to whoever hosts the file archive and he can put it up there, i mean, if they REALLY cant host it because of bandwith then thats the only option, but they dont seem to recognize that others can host it for free..

 

[shrubberyrobbery]

Seems to me that many people seem to want the GP2x to die by focussing on this issue. Why? It is impossible in the modern world to not violate copyright in some form - ever read a mate's magazine? Ever kept a tv program for more than 28 days? Are you using mp3's? Do you watch a dvd with your partner? DO YOU USE ROMS FOR EMULATION (eg on GP2x?).

no you've missed the point. It is MORE like this situation:

you copy a mate's CD. Then you decide to sell it, and keep the money for yourself. Also you take you're mate's CD-burner so that he cannot encroach on your market, by selling his own copies.

 

[oneandoneis2]

Perhaps somebody should point them to BitTorrent?

DijiTao: Strictly speaking, you can't call someone a criminal until they've been convicted of commiting a crime. At the moment, at most, they are "alleged criminals": Apart from anything else, the GPL doesn't actually give a specific time frame that the source code must be supplied within. So although you gain the right to request the source code as soon as you buy it, they aren't actually obliged to deliver it the instant you request it.

 

[Radek]

I want only to add that all this controversy isn't that bad...

GP2x is getting some free appearance at least. And this isn't bad, isn't at all.

 

[DijiTao]

Defending this behavior is just plain dumb. They have been given plenty of time to get their shit together but apparently they don’t want to. It’s high time they get motivated. Here are some good suggestions I’ve read or thought of myself. Each and every one of these things should happen until GPH comes into compliance:

1 – Close the gp32x.de gp2x downloads section
2 – No developer should release anything for the gp2x
3 – Distributors (gp32z, gbax etc…) should stop selling the gp2x
4 – No news post on gp32x.de about the gp2x unless it’s related to them coming into compliance with the GPL
5 – Hold a contest to come up with an image designed to shame GPH into complying with the GPL
5 –Distributors display the GPH GPL Shame image on the pages where they would normally sell the gp2x
6 – Replace the wiki with a site that only displays the GPH GPL Shame image
7 – Post the GPH GPL Shame image to the gp32x news everyday with a count of how many days GPH has been in violation
8 – Everyone post to the official gp2x suggestion box complaining about the situation daily if not more often. (http://www.gpx2.com/support/support_sugest_input.asp)
9 – Write a nice thoughtful email to GPH trying to explain why what they are doing is wrong.
10 – After the above steps are taken attempt to get this new story onto Slashdot and other news sites to draw even more attention to the problem

I don’t think GPH could hold out very long at all if there was that kind of show of solidarity against their behavior.

@oneandoneis2
You sir are correct, "alleged criminals" is the right term- and if I were them I would think really hard about how I would continue to conduct my business. Stopping the sale of the GP2X voluntarily seems to me to be leaps and bounds easier then by court order.

 

[AcidiC]

Let's just create an online petition and get it over and done with :rolleyes:

 

[DijiTao]

Let's just create an online petition and get it over and done with :rolleyes:

​

I don't know if your being sacastic or not - but an online petition would do nothing -- The things I'm suggestion would be *VERY* visible, and thus actually hurt sales / PR.

 

[AcidiC]

Shame!

 

[Muncher666]

And potentially kill the handheld.

Yes, I understand there is a large level of violation here, and DIGNSYS are to blame. I also acknowledge that GPH isn't leaning hard enough on them. But I really want the poor little 2x to flourish, and I feel that some of your steps are more likely to kill the 2x rather than help it's open sourcey nature.

Allan.

 

[Silberstein]

I don't understand why people defend Gamepark (or Dignsys) by saying they got enough on their backs already.. How hard would it be just to upload the damn code on a ftp server and supply the link? If bandwith is a problem (it REALLY shouln't be) they could distribute it as a torrent.. It would take about 5 minutes.. I think not just the communety would profit from a totally open kernel source, but also Gamepark themselves, and not just by gathering goodwill. By integrating fanmade contributions in the official firmware they could cut down development costs AND please the communaty...

 

[DijiTao]

And potentially kill the handheld.

Yes, I understand there is a large level of violation here, and DIGNSYS are to blame. I also acknowledge that GPH isn't leaning hard enough on them. But I really want the poor little 2x to flourish, and I feel that some of your steps are more likely to kill the 2x rather than help it's open sourcey nature.

Allan.

​

Then how would you suggest the community leans harder on GPH to get them to lean harder on Dignsys?

If ED, Cragix, Jr2swiss, snaff, Squidge, DJWillis, Franxis, Reesy, rlyeh, skeezix, pepone , and anybody else who's making GPH money collectivly agree to give GPH a deadline to come into complance, and if GPH fails to meet that deadline my suggestions happen -- I think GPH would come into complance rather than face utter faliure. I want from GPH not only the source, but a statement saying that everytime they make a binary release of the firmware they will also release the source code AT THE SAME TIME.

 

[Tobriand]

I imagine it'd more likely slow it down (at least, assuming the source was released soonish) - bear in mind, after all, that the 2x has already sold 8000 units in the kind of time period it took the GP32 to sell probably their first 1000. The only way it'd kill the console is if it drove everyone's interest away from it.

Not that I'd feel entirely comfortable about a suspension of releases, being a complete end user, of course. But I doubt it would actually kill the system.

Interest, interestingly, could probably be kept high simply by continuing to have announcements about breakthroughs in development - just no new releases. Bearing in mind the community is one of the great things about both the GP32 and the GP2x, as long as that doesn't vanish, people will probably still be interested.

Just maybe not quite as much so...