COVID-19 / Coronavirus Pandemic


JDTAY

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I just had a thought too. These vaccines aren't vegan. Not that it matters to me, but I wonder how the vegans are handling it.
 

pyrat

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I just had a thought too. These vaccines aren't vegan. Not that it matters to me, but I wonder how the vegans are handling it.
I don't remember anymore, but I think that was one of the questions in the FAQ of one or two of the medical authorities that I once read. They said something that the vaccine production does not use animal products (or was it no other animals than humans? don't remember). Try CDC, EMA or ECDC or some such.

In any case all vegans eat animals, it's very difficult not to do it. I wash my vegetables as best as I can but I still quite likely eat some accarids or small (microscopic) invertebrates with them. Even if all the active component of vaccines were animal, I guess it'd still be less than whatever animal dose any vegan eats weekly, because the weight of the vaccine doses is really small. To me it looks like splitting hairs.

On the other hand, SARS-CoV2 can attack other animals too, not only humans (I'm not sure how badly). So in case vaccines do anything at all to stop transmission (which is very hard to know for transmission between humans, let alone transmission from humans to other species), then vaccinating might be a way to protect other animals from SARS-Cov-2. Who knows?

Now if some animalist thinks that viruses are alive, and that SARS-CoV-2 is somehow an animal, then that most likely changes the story radically. I tend to think (with big doubts) that viruses are not alive, but then if they're alive I suppose plant viruses are vegetal and animal viruses are animals ? I mean their genetic material must ressemble most their hosts, must it not ? I can't think of any virus that attacks both animals and plants. I'm not sure this paragraph is relevant. Even if a vegan should be against eating lions, they would possibly still accept killing a lion if that's the only way not to be eaten by it, although it's always better just not to get close enough.

These are just my intuitions, I don't know the facts and I'm not qualified to judge them, but I think the planet, the animals and life on Earth have very worse problems than COVID-19 vaccines.
 

ZXDunny

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Well I guess there's always eventually herd immunity. Given enough time and too ineffective prevention, any virus will eventually reach all humans, so the ones left alive after long enough must be because they became immune.
Worst case, the herd gets to size 0, but hey, all of those 0 are immune.
Not saying herd immunity is anywhere near a good policy. It's more like a NOP.

As you say, vaccines don't give herd iimunity, at most might let people become infected and survive, and that infection give them better immunity, but I have no clue whether natural infection (with or without vaccine) leaves you any less likely to spread than vaccine.
I simply think nobody knows and the world is basically divided into those who don't want to see the problem, and those which want to do anything that might be sold as a solution. I'm almost alone in thinking that the solution is not something to do, but some things to stop doing.

Herd immunity is going to be difficult to achieve. So far, our research seems to show (and could indeed be hearsay or outright wrong) that a COVID infection grants immunity for around 8 months, after which time you can catch it again. That gives us a roughly 8 month window during which everyone needs to catch it in order for it to die out.

That's gonna be tough to achieve.
 

Linux-SWAT

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--EDIT:
Pierre Nkurunziza died in June 2020, so unlikely to have decided anything:
But it could be interesting to follow what could "happen" to his successor:
 
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TeDaDeS

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I just had a thought too. These vaccines aren't vegan. Not that it matters to me, but I wonder how the vegans are handling it.

If PETA said it was okay, I might believe it's true.

Do the COVID-19 vaccines contain animal-derived ingredients?​

The vaccines that are likely to be available to Australians soonest – those made by Pfizer-BioNTech and Oxford-AstraZeneca – do not contain any animal-derived ingredients, though animal-derived materials may have been used in the production process.
 

netcat

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My friend worked as a lab technician researching RNA (yes!) 20 years ago. The process relied heavily on experimenting on mice. The lab went through several hundred thousand mice a year. They bred them on site. Ethical_concerns++
 

JDTAY

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I went to a minor league baseball game last night where no-one was wearing masks. Yay America, yay freedom.

Cases are up, but still under 1000 in any day in this state. It's hard to remember, but we were averaging over 1000 a day just back in May. No need to panic, right?
 

FBnil

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Linux-SWAT

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"Who controls the past controls the future. Who controls the present controls the past"

 

JDTAY

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Cases for the prior day in my county are listed as 27 on the main page of the NC COVID-19 dashboard. The testing page only goes up to two days ago though, but it looks like it was around half that many cases the day before the prior day. I mean, I guess I'll know tomorrow what the testing rate was like for that 27 day.

27 in a day isn't that bad for a county of around 200,000 people, right?
 

Linux-SWAT

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A nurse is allergic to the Pfizer "vaccine", so she can't be shot without being under scrutiny, so she will not be shot before the mandatory deadline, so she will be an outlaw.
 

pyrat

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Herd immunity is going to be difficult to achieve. So far, our research seems to show (and could indeed be hearsay or outright wrong) that a COVID infection grants immunity for around 8 months, after which time you can catch it again. That gives us a roughly 8 month window during which everyone needs to catch it in order for it to die out.

That's gonna be tough to achieve.
That may be so. I thought natural immunity lasted longer, but I never read anything definitive about it. But my point (or whatever it was) was more than with enough time, either the virus dies out or the people die out. If people are vulnerable again in 8 months, and say one in 20 infected die, then with the virus everywhere, people should die in 8*20 months (somewhat wild assumptions there, but you get the idea, make it 15 years or 20 if you want, but if the virus stays it'll eventually infect everyone multiple times and eventually kill all, or else we'll assume survivors are immune). If the virus is deadly then the herd either becomes immune or dies and becomes an immune 0-size herd. Yes there could be other possibilities, like people under 20 are immune and the older population dying is slow enough to reproduce more young humans and replenish the herd, I glossed over too many details, but I was only trying to say that herd immunity is just letting the virus do its business, it's no policy at all, it's a form of denial.
 
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