Installation System / Game Marketplace?


t-strike

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I'm new to this forum, but i read a lot about the Pandora project and really like what you guys did so far. This is an ideal gaming/multi purpose device, but only for the more experienced user i'm afraid. I read about the .PND archives that are plain easy to install simply by copying it, but a novice user won't be able to do so or wouldn't know where to find any games or applications at all.

What Pandora needs to make it a huge hit with the large public, is an easy to use (de)installing/search system for games (and applications, or even music and video for that means) that everyone can use, even a four year old child and even an 80-year old grandma.

Well, i'm quite an experienced user, i started programming on the C64 and still code PHP professionally, but when i would be buying this device (which would probably be happening somewhere this year), i want to use the Pandora merely as a fun device. Not for experimentation or as a mini-laptop, but as a simple game controller with mp3 and avi playback options, the wanna-have travel companion. When i use the Pandora that way, i don't want to spend hours or even days looking around the internet, reading and browsing forums, browsing through huge file archives, etc just to find some fun games or applications i want to have. I want to login, see what's available and have that by the click of a mouse. It doesn't need to be any harder than that, and it shouldn't be.

I also read about the Package Manager system from dflemstr, but that one is more like a file repository for developers and not what i mean, though a system like that could be used as a filling database for what i mean.

What i mean is a simple application, a nice looking, smooth and appealing graphical interface and extremely easy to operate, something like the Wii Shop channel, XBox Live Shop, Apple shop or even a digital dvd rental machine you see in the streets nowadays. Simply start the application, browse around and click on the game or application that you want to install, but also see the games that are already installed and provide the option to deinstall or update (if available). That way everyone, even people with absolutely no technical knowledge, can use this Pandora. This installation system should be implemented in the 'easy' environment from the Pandora, so it's directly in the interface.

In my considerations, this kind of software would make the Pandora open for the masses. Advanced users can use the desktop environment, command lines or whatever they like to operate the system, and all other users can simply click-and-play. In a future stage, besides all free software you might even offer payed games and applications, like the iphone shop, to extend the posibilities and even provide the opportunity for developers to commercially exploit this great platform. I know it's sour for the open-source community, but if software is really good, sometimes it IS worth money and i personally would be willing to pay for value-added software. If everything is available in ONE central easy-to-use environment, that is in my opinion what should give Pandora that last edge of advantage.
 

puppydee

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You only need to goto http://dl.openhandhelds.org/cgi-bin/pandora.cgi to find all the games, apps, emulators etc when available. The pandora will be easy to use. My nephew is 7 and he can upgrade firmware and load games, emulators on the gp2x so the pandora should be a breeze. Just my 2 cents anyway. Welcome to the forum btw :)
 

t-strike

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But just look at that website, it's exactly what i mean that it shouldn't be.

It's not easy to use for a novice, and there's hardly anything on it. Only one game? I've heard of at least 10 games being mentioned here on the forum. And where are the emulators? 0 files.

No, it should be far more simpler than this, and with a far easier interface. And version management should be included somehow.

Try a Wii, go to the shopping channel and see what i mean. It simply doesn't compare.
 

MrBlais

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t-strike said:
But just look at that website, it's exactly what i mean that it shouldn't be.

It's not easy to use for a novice, and there's hardly anything on it. Only one game? I've heard of at least 10 games being mentioned here on the forum. And where are the emulators? 0 files.

No, it should be far more simpler than this, and with a far easier interface. And version management should be included somehow.
Did you know the Pandora has not been released yet? No software or firmware updates can be available for something that doesn't exist yet...

t-strike said:
Try a Wii, go to the shopping channel and see what i mean. It simply doesn't compare.
This one just made me laugh.. Since when was an independant hardware company as large and successful as Nintendo? Your ideas are WAY too broad for a piece of hardware in it's infancy.

My advice to you; come back later and then you can profess your complaints when they actually hold weight..

EDIT: Fixed typo
 
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t-strike

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Okay, maybe i am a bit early, but the hardware will come to market within a short term from now. Maybe even this or next months if all goes well, as i read the blogs.

Software can be made in advance, such as all other software which is in the process of development for this machine. I think, this kind of software is quite essential for providing the Pandora with all-round success, outside of the elite hacking enthousiast scene. Therefore, start developing such a kind of software in this stage, prior to public release, wouldn't be strange at all.

And the wii channel is just an example. In fact, the setup of the wii channel isn't special at all. You don't need to be Nintendo to make anything like that, it would in fact be really easy programming material and lots of things might even be improved. The thing is, simplicity (as seen in the wii channel) works.

I'm not bashing anything, i just think omitting such a big feature at the start, might resolve in problems later (as a negative aspect in reviews, etc.). With a good marketplace software system, the sales of the Pandora system might run into millions of these devices, instead of thousands. And don't we all want Pandora to be a huge success?
 

Sphinxter

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The average moron's inability to click an icon, launch a web browser, click a bookmark, browse a website, right click on a PND and, 'Save Link As', to an SD card does not worry me much. The pandora will succeed because it's open, not because it's married to some proprietary appstore like an iphone. The complete lack of some corporate controlled choke point in software distribution is it's greatest feature.
 

Tuxedomask29

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t-strike said:
I'm new to this forum, but i read a lot about the Pandora project and really like what you guys did so far. This is an ideal gaming/multi purpose device, but only for the more experienced user i'm afraid. I read about the .PND archives that are plain easy to install simply by copying it, but a novice user won't be able to do so or wouldn't know where to find any games or applications at all.

What Pandora needs to make it a huge hit with the large public, is an easy to use (de)installing/search system for games (and applications, or even music and video for that means) that everyone can use, even a four year old child and even an 80-year old grandma.

Well, i'm quite an experienced user, i started programming on the C64 and still code PHP professionally, but when i would be buying this device (which would probably be happening somewhere this year), i want to use the Pandora merely as a fun device. Not for experimentation or as a mini-laptop, but as a simple game controller with mp3 and avi playback options, the wanna-have travel companion. When i use the Pandora that way, i don't want to spend hours or even days looking around the internet, reading and browsing forums, browsing through huge file archives, etc just to find some fun games or applications i want to have. I want to login, see what's available and have that by the click of a mouse. It doesn't need to be any harder than that, and it shouldn't be.

I also read about the Package Manager system from dflemstr, but that one is more like a file repository for developers and not what i mean, though a system like that could be used as a filling database for what i mean.

What i mean is a simple application, a nice looking, smooth and appealing graphical interface and extremely easy to operate, something like the Wii Shop channel, XBox Live Shop, Apple shop or even a digital dvd rental machine you see in the streets nowadays. Simply start the application, browse around and click on the game or application that you want to install, but also see the games that are already installed and provide the option to deinstall or update (if available). That way everyone, even people with absolutely no technical knowledge, can use this Pandora. This installation system should be implemented in the 'easy' environment from the Pandora, so it's directly in the interface.

In my considerations, this kind of software would make the Pandora open for the masses. Advanced users can use the desktop environment, command lines or whatever they like to operate the system, and all other users can simply click-and-play. In a future stage, besides all free software you might even offer payed games and applications, like the iphone shop, to extend the posibilities and even provide the opportunity for developers to commercially exploit this great platform. I know it's sour for the open-source community, but if software is really good, sometimes it IS worth money and i personally would be willing to pay for value-added software. If everything is available in ONE central easy-to-use environment, that is in my opinion what should give Pandora that last edge of advantage.

Also, you've got to remember that the biggest component of this system is the ability to play emulated games. OK, let's say you have a fancy dancy wii menu (you won't right now, but pretend), you're only going to be able to download the emulators, you'll still have to have the ability to copy files to your SD card to play the games as they can not be legally distributed. Sure, any game like Pandora Panic will be able to just install and play but any emulation will need some more experience. Although, to be honest, I don't know of anyone without the ability to download, copy & paste who isn't under 10 but I'm sure possibly there are some out there. So, yeah, unless you just want to play games made for the pandora and not do emulation, you're going to have to have a bit of experience...
 
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atomicthumbs

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I don't see an N64 emulator on that site! I heard that somebody was working on an N64 emulator! Where is it? This site is bad and needs a better system

Edit:

You guys need to write more games
 

HackModford

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t-strike said:
I'm new to this forum, but i read a lot about the Pandora project and really like what you guys did so far. This is an ideal gaming/multi purpose device, but only for the more experienced user i'm afraid. I read about the .PND archives that are plain easy to install simply by copying it, but a novice user won't be able to do so or wouldn't know where to find any games or applications at all.

What Pandora needs to make it a huge hit with the large public, is an easy to use (de)installing/search system for games (and applications, or even music and video for that means) that everyone can use, even a four year old child and even an 80-year old grandma.

Well, i'm quite an experienced user, i started programming on the C64 and still code PHP professionally, but when i would be buying this device (which would probably be happening somewhere this year), i want to use the Pandora merely as a fun device. Not for experimentation or as a mini-laptop, but as a simple game controller with mp3 and avi playback options, the wanna-have travel companion. When i use the Pandora that way, i don't want to spend hours or even days looking around the internet, reading and browsing forums, browsing through huge file archives, etc just to find some fun games or applications i want to have. I want to login, see what's available and have that by the click of a mouse. It doesn't need to be any harder than that, and it shouldn't be.

I also read about the Package Manager system from dflemstr, but that one is more like a file repository for developers and not what i mean, though a system like that could be used as a filling database for what i mean.

What i mean is a simple application, a nice looking, smooth and appealing graphical interface and extremely easy to operate, something like the Wii Shop channel, XBox Live Shop, Apple shop or even a digital dvd rental machine you see in the streets nowadays. Simply start the application, browse around and click on the game or application that you want to install, but also see the games that are already installed and provide the option to deinstall or update (if available). That way everyone, even people with absolutely no technical knowledge, can use this Pandora. This installation system should be implemented in the 'easy' environment from the Pandora, so it's directly in the interface.

In my considerations, this kind of software would make the Pandora open for the masses. Advanced users can use the desktop environment, command lines or whatever they like to operate the system, and all other users can simply click-and-play. In a future stage, besides all free software you might even offer payed games and applications, like the iphone shop, to extend the posibilities and even provide the opportunity for developers to commercially exploit this great platform. I know it's sour for the open-source community, but if software is really good, sometimes it IS worth money and i personally would be willing to pay for value-added software. If everything is available in ONE central easy-to-use environment, that is in my opinion what should give Pandora that last edge of advantage.

I don't care what everyone is saying. I think this is a lovely idea. It seems very simple to make too.

If you want an example look for "1up" for the DS homebrew scene.
 
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Tuxedomask29

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atomicthumbs said:
I don't see an N64 emulator on that site! I heard that somebody was working on an N64 emulator! Where is it? This site is bad and needs a better system

You just answered your own question. Somebody is working on it, as such, it's not ready so it's not there. Most files won't appear there until the pandora is released.
 
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droneb

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@T-Strike

Maybe watching it from the PHP coder Aproach, i believe that what u wanted to say is that the layout and design of that webpage might not be the best.

i can only say lets wait until the pandora releases, at that point i think there will be a nicer Repo that allows and shows the products/programs in a better way, to make it more "Browseable"(if that word even exist :p).

all the repos are split all over the internet because there are almost no fully functional apps right now even if, theres no actual hardware to use it. plus on development stage the alfa beta and RC files would be outdated easily so it would be no sense of uploading them right now.

as you might already know as a PHP coder, a webpage nor even the best layout script or shape, without content its useless and awfull.

if youre really interested on some of the possible apps available at the future heres a link with tons of intel.

Pandora APPS Proyects Page.

PD: im not sure if you are aware the Panda first wave requires a PreOrder, and since 2 wave is no idea so far, you should check if there are still any available at. Pandora Sales
 

atomicthumbs

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Tuxedomask29 said:
You just answered your own question.  Somebody is working on it, as such, it's not ready so it's not there.  Most files won't appear there until the pandora is released.
woosh
 
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droneb

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atomicthumbs said:
You guys need to write more games

Well, usually it is hard to when theres no actual hardware to test on and the Dev boards are just some around all world.

maybe when the pandora hits the Release pp will boom and go nuts programming. and doing it specially for it due to kayboard nub keys layout

screen size, touch screen specs. ETC.

and you might say alot of pp heard of the pandora, but from what ive seen just a little bunch knows what it really is and its pottential.
so lets wait for its release.
 
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Tuxedomask29

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calc84maniac said:
Wow, I guess nobody caught atomicthumb's sarcasm?

Well, to be honest, with all the newbies, it's hard to tell when someone is being sarcastic and when someone is being serious...
 
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Spykez

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calc84maniac said:
Wow, I guess nobody caught atomicthumb's sarcasm?

exactly what I was thinking, guess everyone is uptight atm over the ignorant first post.

at OP:

You sure are demanding a lot considering everyone here is working on the software for FREE to begin with. You want something fancy and pretty with bells and whistles, start putting your money where your mouth is.
 
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MrBlais

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Sphinxter said:
The average moron's inability to click an icon, launch a web browser, click a bookmark, browse a website, right click on a PND and, 'Save Link As', to an SD card does not worry me much. The pandora will succeed because it's open, not because it's married to some proprietary appstore like an iphone. The complete lack of some corporate controlled choke point in software distribution is it's greatest feature.

Everything in this post is a win..

You must be intelligence deficient if you can't figure out how to copy and paste...
 
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danielliu88888

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calc84maniac said:
Wow, I guess nobody caught atomicthumb's sarcasm?
or they haven't been here long enough.


honestly though, downloading files and putting them onto your SD card shouldn't be too hard. obviously, consumers are used to living the "ipod life", buying stuff through apple's proprietary application store. it can't be too hard to access the file archive on the pandora and download what you want so it goes right onto the sd card. and with cpas's menu, it will automatically detect the pnd file and list it in the menu under whatever category. that should be easy enough. but i don't know, maybe it would be better for the average consumer to have something that can directly access the file archive, which saves this forum from a few useless topics.
 
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gruso

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Xian Long said:
honestly though, downloading files and putting them onto your SD card shouldn't be too hard. obviously, consumers are used to living the "ipod life", buying stuff through apple's proprietary application store. it can't be too hard to access the file archive on the pandora and download what you want so it goes right onto the sd card. and with cpas's menu, it will automatically detect the pnd file and list it in the menu under whatever category.

Exactly, and as I understand it, the PND system is being designed so that this happens no matter which menu you're using (Pmenu/Pangea/whatevs). For anyone who thinks this is complicated, here's a comparison:

iPhone:
- Browse to appstore from iPhone.
- Find your app, click install. It is installed.
- Alternatively, get the app via your PC, then sync it to iPhone.

Pandora:
- Browse to file archive from Pandora.
- Find your app, click download. Select a folder to save the PND file in. It is installed.
- Alternatively, get the PND via your PC, then drag and drop to Pandora.

What's the main difference? Aesthetics, and a couple of extra clicks for PND files. And once 3,000+ people have hardware in their hands, it's only a matter of time until someone adds the aesthetics and removes those terrifying extra clicks.
 
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MrBlais

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I think it's just the pretty factor, too..

People are too comfortable and complacent with their UI's for the iPhone/etc... Possibly even too lazy to try..
 
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