Bluetooth Works, But I Need Some Help :)


pelrun

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Tethered mobile phones CAN NOT talk to modems. They *look* like modems to your computer, but they directly talk to the carrier network. You can only connect to your carrier's data service (which has a magic phone number) and to no other.
 

Tor

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In case this needs clarification:

YES, it's entirely possible to use good old dial-up via a GSM phone, just as you would with a land line. It works the same way: You need to connect your computer (I've only done this with a cable, because it's been a while) or with bluetooth. Then use AT commands just as you would with the landline phone. There could be some phones out there that don't support the AT command set though, that would be the only potential problem.

I used to do this with an Ericsson GSM phone (before Sony-Ericsson came along).

EDIT: I used to this from across country borders too (yes, it was expensive..), the only country it didn't work for was from Sweden, because their network would chop off bit 8 somehow. This was back in the late 90's.

EDIT2: In case it's not clear: The dial-up phone number I used was the landline at work.

EDIT3: Read my update about this 2 posts below.
 

Aninhumer

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It seems I might be wrong then.
I didn't think the way a GSM connection worked could transmit the signals in the same way a modem does over a landline?
To my understanding, a modem modulates signals into the audio stream relying on a particular quality of signal, whereas the audio signals transmitted by GSM are compressed.

However it's quite clear there are at least two people here who have used it in just this way, and googling around, I've found similar reports.

I have no idea then. :p

EDIT: I've seen some people talking about it being much slower than normal dial-up, perhaps it worked at the slower connection rates, even over a compressed line?
 

Tor

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@Aninhumer: Thinking back (hey, it's been > 10 years..) I believe the dial-up connection wasn't modulating the audio on the GSM signal, the phone went into 'data mode' (which was probably [strike]GPRS[/strike][1], but that term wasn't used then). But it still worked just as you would expect for a modem. I started with a dial-up connection from a Windows machine, but that was impossible to use because the GSM signal was weak and unreliable and there were frequent disconnects. Windows is in the habit of breaking TCP/IP connections if the network layer breaks, which is not only against the protocol but also made the connection useless - I had to start over and over all the time and got astronomical phone bills. I scratched the OS and installed Linux and used that from then on, and had no more problems (and my bills dropped to acceptable levels).

The 'data mode' probably explains how the Swedish telecom could strip bit 8 (and make the connection useless). I seem to remember that it was said you could go up to 19200 bps over dial-up. So yes, slower than 56k modems (which are mostly 33k most of the time). The modem in the other end (the landline at work) was just a standard old 9600 bps modem. But over that 9600bps line I was running CVS repository updates over compressed SSH and it served me well on a daily basis for nearly a year (I was stationed in a foreign country with little normal Internet and used the GSM phone to stay in contact with the home base). It worked fine from there and elsewhere, the exception being when trying to connect from Sweden.

[1]EDIT: Actually GPRS wasn't in use yet at the time. It could have been CDPD, which would explain the 19200 bps data rate limit. This could also mean that the kind of dial-up networking I used to do over a GSM phone may not be possible anymore (in particular the connection to any phone number). This I am not able to verify.
 

urjaman

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Tor said:
@Aninhumer: Thinking back (hey, it's been > 10 years..) I believe the dial-up connection wasn't modulating the audio on the GSM signal, the phone went into 'data mode' (which was probably [strike]GPRS[/strike][1], but that term wasn't used then). But it still worked just as you would expect for a modem. I started with a dial-up connection from a Windows machine, but that was impossible to use because the GSM signal was weak and unreliable and there were frequent disconnects. Windows is in the habit of breaking TCP/IP connections if the network layer breaks, which is not only against the protocol but also made the connection useless - I had to start over and over all the time and got astronomical phone bills. I scratched the OS and installed Linux and used that from then on, and had no more problems (and my bills dropped to acceptable levels).

The 'data mode' probably explains how the Swedish telecom could strip bit 8 (and make the connection useless). I seem to remember that it was said you could go up to 19200 bps over dial-up. So yes, slower than 56k modems (which are mostly 33k most of the time). The modem in the other end (the landline at work) was just a standard old 9600 bps modem. But over that 9600bps line I was running CVS repository updates over compressed SSH and it served me well on a daily basis for nearly a year (I was stationed in a foreign country with little normal Internet and used the GSM phone to stay in contact with the home base). It worked fine from there and elsewhere, the exception being when trying to connect from Sweden.

[1]EDIT: Actually GPRS wasn't in use yet at the time. It could have been CDPD, which would explain the 19200 bps data rate limit. This could also mean that the kind of dial-up networking I used to do over a GSM phone may not be possible anymore (in particular the connection to any phone number). This I am not able to verify.
I believe you were using http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Circuit_Switched_Data which allows just that, dialling normal 9.6kbaud PSTN modems over GSM networks.
CSD uses a single radio time slot to deliver 9.6 kbit/s data transmission to the GSM Network and Switching Subsystem where it could be connected through the equivalent of a normal modem to the Public Switched Telephone Network (PSTN) allowing direct calls to any dial-up service.
 
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Tor

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Thanks urjaman, that sounds like it could be it. I wonder if the system is still functional. It did work all over / across Europe at the time.
 

EvilDragon

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Well, found some more time to play around with Bluetooth.
I now managed to successfully connect my Pandora via Bluetooth PAN to my mobile phone.
I get an IP address via dhcp, I can resolve the DNS, I can ping my phone, route is setup correctly.
I just can't connect to any site on the internet, but I guess that's due to my phone - I use a custom baked ROM on my phone, so that might be the problem. Never used BT before :)

Need to find another phone I can try.

That means you should be able to use your phone if it supports bluetooth PAN for mobile internet on the Pandora on-the-go :)
 

j.pickens

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Sounds nice, but every US provider I've dealt with disables Bluetooth DUN on their phones.
I know ATT and Verizon do, at least.
They want to sell you a smartphone or an aircard, so they disable this very useful function.
I hate monopolies...
 

Dead1nside

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j.pickens said:
Sounds nice, but every US provider I've dealt with disables Bluetooth DUN on their phones.
I know ATT and Verizon do, at least.
They want to sell you a smartphone or an aircard, so they disable this very useful function.
I hate monopolies...

The UK networks are not as bad as that. You're still not technically allowed to use your mobile internet package on anything other than your mobile, which precludes using it as a 3G modem -- I still do though.

They've recently kicked up a fuss, again, about Skype on the Ovi Store. Haven't heard any objections about the N900s built in Skype though, and Vodafone UK who has the exclusive was one of the people to disable SIP on the N95 wayback, along with Orange. "We don't want to be just dumb pipes", tough luck!
 
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Alpha2

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See this is why I dont use the free phones they offer at Tmobile, I dont get their fancy bells and whistles but I also dont get their restrictions. I may pay 200 bucks for a phone but it lasts for years and if I ditch my provider for greener pastures I can take my phone with me... I cant afford cellular internet with the whole economic downturn thing, but when I can my phone just needs to be set up.
 

emil10001

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j.pickens said:
Sounds nice, but every US provider I've dealt with disables Bluetooth DUN on their phones.
I know ATT and Verizon do, at least.
They want to sell you a smartphone or an aircard, so they disable this very useful function.
I hate monopolies...

They will enable that feature for you if you pay for it. Though, it costs something like $60/mo for dumbphones to act as a modem for unlimited service. I still like my G1, rooted, and using the wifi tether app (which also does bluetooth tethering).
 
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Twiitcher

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I have TMobile (US) and a Sony Ericcson TM506 handset, I bought off Craigs List for $40.00. I had $50.00 a month bill for 5 Faves, 300 minutes and 400 messages monthly. I added unlimited internet for $10.00 monthly, since it isn't a 'smart' phone that pricing is available.

Here's the good news, Google voice as one of my favs = unlimited calling, I can dial my gv number to make outgoing calls - Tmobile sees my it as an incomming call from GV - so no charge, and if people call my GV # it's a fav so free that way also. I seldom need to use it as my other 4 favs are the numbers I use the most minutes on, but if I'm especially verbose on any given month, I have the option. Also tethering via BT / DUN works on the phone as I bought it .. not sure if the FW was patched or not, but it seems to be a pretty easy process. I don't have a USB cable for it yet, but TM506 forums claim faster, easy connectivity via cable.

Seems like the magic combination of functionality and price, best I could find anyways. The phone serves my needs fine, twitter/opera/ google maps/youtube video streaming, ect and the ability to run .jar stuff pretty well. No qwerty keyboard so I try to not do any lengthy typing but it IS just a phone.

My feeling is as long as I have a tetherable phone it won't matter about the features once I have my Pandora.. the phone will be what phones always should have been, a phone.. the Pandora will be the smart device, I just need to leech the connection off whatever phone I have. In a nutshell once we have our pandora's all we need is the cheapest phone w/unlimited minutes and tethering capabilities for the cheapest montlhy cost, as least that's the paradigm I use when deciding on my phone from here on in.

Twiitcher
 
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emil10001 said:
j.pickens said:
Sounds nice, but every US provider I've dealt with disables Bluetooth DUN on their phones.
I know ATT and Verizon do, at least.
They want to sell you a smartphone or an aircard, so they disable this very useful function.
I hate monopolies...

They will enable that feature for you if you pay for it. Though, it costs something like $60/mo for dumbphones to act as a modem for unlimited service. I still like my G1, rooted, and using the wifi tether app (which also does bluetooth tethering).

I've found recently with Verizon at least, that instead of blocking this feature completely, they allow you to make the connection to the phone and then DNS redirect you to a site to sign up for their extra $30/mo service. Thank goodness for my Android phone and the android-wifi-tether package.
 
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