Should I stick to my PS3, or get myself a custom-made PC


I want to thank you all for the help! Especially Scooby, who convinced this was the right one! :D


Cost 850 usd


518692 AMD Phenom II X4 965, Black Edition


618010 Corsair XMS3 1600MHz 8GB Vengeance™ CL9


591141 WD Caviar® Black™ 1TB SATA 3.0


575192 WD Caviar® Green™ 2TB SATA 2.0


617740 Sapphire Radeon HD6850 1GB TOXIC PCI-E


585260 Gigabyte GA-890GPA-UD3H, Socket-AM3


488176 Sony DVD±RW AD-5260S BLACK/SATA


612436 Corsair CX 600W PSU


604766 Cooler Master HAF 912 Plus Midi Tower
You got a lot of bang for your buck!!!!!


You will be fine for anything with that set up and can always change vid cards. Although I think the Radeon will take you a long way.


Crysis 2 will play well on it :p That is a benchmark.


Congrats Viking!!!
 
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How is nVidia "perfectly supported" under Linux? Unlike ATI/AMD the open source driver team isn't working with anything approaching full specs, and if you're going proprietary they (nVidia) control what kernel you're on.


Honestly the "ATI/AMD has driver problems" thing seems to be the equivalent of the internet bit bandied about that 5.56x45mm lacks "stopping power." nVidia has had plenty of driver problems, including literal card killers. These problems were the point Microsoft SUED nVidia over how absolutely horrid their drivers were when Vista launched in 2007.


The reality is that most systems wll be fine, except for the occassional need for tweaking to run a fresh off the presses game properly regardless of whether it's ATI/AMD or nVidia.


Asmo:


You're arguing DRM not PC versus Console. GOG.com renders your point moot as it's gaining enough momentum they are going to start publishing newer titles DRM-free. Not to mention other big successes like the Humble Indie Bundles. Further software DRM is often enough cracked off by the actual company these days after a given point, nevermind the less legal side of things. This is in addition to the fact the most popular game distribution service, Steam, basically insures your games are secure and transferable. Ergo software DRM isn't _that_ big a problem if a consumer is intelligent about it, and even at it's worst not quite as bad you try to portray it.


Meanwhile the hardware DRM fundamental to console design since the early 1980s means unless you want to crack the disk encryption on a computer, and in some cases are lucky enough to have the right hardware where that's even possible, it sets up a fundamental problem your theoretical 20 years later. You see the PS3 and XBox 360 not only need a drive with moving parts to read that disk, but aren't the hardiest designed electronic devices ever. So finding one that would work 20 years down the line is by no means a guarantee. This is of course ignoring that there's no reason that software publishers will not eventually institute DRM software on console platforms if the trend keeps going that way.


The PC owner on the other hand once software DRM has been neutralized only has problems to the extent either WinE, Virtual machines, or Microsoft's integral backwards compatibility capabilities are insufficient.
 
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How is nVidia "perfectly supported" under Linux? Unlike ATI/AMD the open source driver team isn't working with anything approaching full specs, and if you're going proprietary they (nVidia) control what kernel you're on.

I understand what you say, but the original poster is a gamer, so if he wants to play under Linux, the answer is simple : Nvidia.
 
But since this was so cheap, I could easily get a better card later on. Can't I have both 560ti and the current card in the same time?

No, you would not gain any performance by having both an ATI card and an Nvidia card at the same time, not sure if it is even possible to get such a set up working.


Do you have any previous experience of PC gaming? If not, then are you prepared to spend some time learning about how to configure settings to get the most out of your PC? If you want a 'plug & play' experience then you really should stick to the PS3.


Just to give some explanation of why PC gaming can be a pain in the arse for some :


A few months ago I bought Borderlands GOTY edition for approx £5 in a steam sale. The game ran OK but did not look exactly great and suffered some frame rate issues despite me having way beyond the recommended specs for the game.


To sort it out and get it running super smooth & super pretty I had to alter some in game graphics settings, edit an ini file & also change a few things in the graphics card control panel. This took about an hour before I was really happy it was using the available hardware to its true potential. A quick web search gave me a few pointers, a general understanding built from years of experience of the somewhat complicated options for graphics setting in the Nvidia control panel did the rest. Call me weird but I find the tinkering process highly enjoyable, almost like a puzzle game in itself, my guess is that most 'normal' people would find this side of things to be a complete pain in the arse.
 
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Just have fun with it and don't worry about all these critical, know it alls out there.^ ;)


Your PC is no harder owning than someone owning a Pandora with no Linux experience and no clue about how emulators work.


It's a great machine.
 
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Well, to be honest, you guys are looking at a person with no special experience with PC or Linux or Pandora. But I have fiddled with them, but never sought out any deeper understanding. Every time I had a problem with something f.ex. how to use the terminal in Linux, or my HDD in my laptop died and had to change it my self. Or how to get the MSX emulator on the Pandora to work, I just either goggled it, asked you guys or simply tried it. So actually, I like stuff that aren't plug n' play! It gives the consumer something to work on, to explore, and you learn a lot from the process. And the satisfaction you get when it works, oh I remember when I had to tweak with WineHQ to make Age of Empires II Multiplayer playable in Ubuntu, after 2 1/2 hours, I was so pleased :D


So if I have to learn to tweak the graphic card or bin files them self, then I can't wait! But is it perhaps necessary to tweak every game?


But yeah, Mr Loon, I think we're pretty alike, when it comes to solving such issues it's pretty fun!


And critics is important! Gives one more insight one the pros and cons :p


And I still can't thank you enough Scooby! Can't wait till my pc arrives!!


And if anyone is interested what I used as a gaming PC for about 5-6 years now:


Compal FL90 notebook

  • Intel Core 2 Duo T7300 2 GHz 4MB L2 Cache, 800MHz FSB
  • Intel Crestline PM965
  • 2048 MB, Kingston Dual Channel DDR2-667, 2x 1GB, max. 4096MB

    NVIDIA GeForce 8600M GT - 256 MB GDDR2 400MHz

    160GB 7200rpm Seagate ST9160823AS

    1GB Turbo Memory (Robson), 4-in-1 card reader (SD, MMC, MS, MS Pro), Nero Express V6
 
Asmo:


You're arguing DRM not PC versus Console. GOG.com renders your point moot as it's gaining enough momentum they are going to start publishing newer titles DRM-free.

The difference in DRM implementation on the two platforms does make it a PC vs Console point given the OP's question, albeit one which may not matter to many. If you have the 'collector' mindset, it may. If you just gorge on games and move on it won't matter one iota.


I did add that it will probably "change in due course"! I'd bet it will, but the OP has a PS3. Today.


I also conceded that his genre of choice was more PC suited anyway.


GOG.com's service won't render it moot until they sell current non-DRM titles, the OP is comparing the two for current & forthcoming titles.


If the question was simply which platform was technically superior, all this would be irrelevant for sure.

This is in addition to the fact the most popular game distribution service, Steam, basically insures your games are secure and transferable. Ergo software DRM isn't _that_ big a problem if a consumer is intelligent about it, and even at it's worst not quite as bad you try to portray it.

Heres hoping they're still around and unhacked when I dig up that copy of Half Life 4 in the attic in 20 years time and try to install & activate it then, otherwise there could be trouble ;)


So long as you can find and power up an ancient PS3, there's a reasonable expectation that a disc that hasn't been used as a coaster up to then will work without the need for any 3rd party input, so even if the world outside has succumbed to the zombie holocaust and there is no internet, you can at least play. It's worth bearing in mind ;)


"As bad as I try to portray it"? I don't think I claimed it would burn your house down or anything... just that it could be an unholy PITA. Even those are not, by definition, insurmountable. Just unholy and a PITA. :)
 
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IS HALF-LIFE 4 OUT!? WAAAAAAAAAT??


And here I thought Half-Life 2 ep.3 was still under development :p
 
IS HALF-LIFE 4 OUT!? WAAAAAAAAAT??


And here I thought Half-Life 2 ep.3 was still under development :p

Of course it's out - 20 years from now. They have terrible teething problems with the holographic monitor drivers accidentally resulting in a few casualties, but it all gets fixed with a minor 15Tb patch released the following week.
 
IS HALF-LIFE 4 OUT!? WAAAAAAAAAT??


And here I thought Half-Life 2 ep.3 was still under development :p

Of course it's out - 20 years from now. They have terrible teething problems with the holographic monitor drivers accidentally resulting in a few casualties, but it all gets fixed with a minor 15Tb patch released the following week.

That actually made me laugh quite a bit :D
 
Haha! My friend just bought about the same pc I bought yesterday! But he payed 150 $ extra :p
 
My PC has arrived, and I love it! I'm gonna play some games before taking pics and opening it up and change the fan to a water cooler :p


Played Serious Sam 3 on Ultra, I screamed like those beheaded zombie dudes when they come running at you! THIS.....IS....AWESOMEEEEE!!!
 
My PC has arrived, and I love it! I'm gonna play some games before taking pics and opening it up and change the fan to a water cooler :p


Played Serious Sam 3 on Ultra, I screamed like those beheaded zombie dudes when they come running at you! THIS.....IS....AWESOMEEEEE!!!

Nice one Viking, glad to hear you're loving it.


Just wondering why you're thinking of adding water cooling. Is it for overclocking the CPU? If so then I'd really recommend that you see how it runs without overclocking as most games rely far more on the GPU than the CPU. And last time I looked water cooling kit was pretty expensive.


Also make sure you don't use too much thermal paste when adding the new cooling system, wish someone told me that a few years ago when I swapped the heatsink / fan on my old Athlon.
 
My brother recommended it, but I don't see why I should get one. My computer hasn't had any problem with overheating, but yeah, I gave my Corsair H60 to my brother instead as a early Christmas gift :)


And the H60 cost less than 100$ at the same site I bought the PC :p
 
But since this was so cheap, I could easily get a better card later on. Can't I have both 560ti and the current card in the same time?
No, you would not gain any performance by having both an ATI card and an Nvidia card at the same time, not sure if it is even possible to get such a set up working.
Well it sort of was, but nVidia didn't want people using an nVidia card for PhysX, and pairing it with a ATI card for graphics so they setup their drivers to make that so it wouldn't work.

Asmo:


You're arguing DRM not PC versus Console. GOG.com renders your point moot as it's gaining enough momentum they are going to start publishing newer titles DRM-free.
The difference in DRM implementation on the two platforms does make it a PC vs Console point given the OP's question, albeit one which may not matter to many. If you have the 'collector' mindset, it may. If you just gorge on games and move on it won't matter one iota.


I did add that it will probably "change in due course"! I'd bet it will, but the OP has a PS3. Today.
So you're still arguing from a "collector" standpoint but are ignoring the hardware reliability issues, and that software DRM really is not that hard to bypass, because you're more interested in your narrative then it having any relation to reality?

GOG.com's service won't render it moot until they sell current non-DRM titles
Witcher 2 and as I said GOG is shifting toward stocking new games as well.

Heres hoping they're still around and unhacked when I dig up that copy of Half Life 4 in the attic in 20 years time and try to install & activate it then, otherwise there could be trouble ;)
You clearly have no appreciation of how Steamworks, works. Once you've registered the game with an account it's locked to that account. Steamwork is not Starforce, once the game ID is locked into an account there is no reactivations and the game disks are actually largely pointless to keep around given the limited delta-rpm equivalent Steamworks uses isn't that wonderful. This is pretty much the norm for all the various Digital download services with the differences revolving around how DRM is handled and the nature of the client.

Let's give a real world example of how this security works. Ritual Entertainment has been dead for years, eaten by a casual game company, after they overextended themselves in 2006 with SiN:Episode 1. I bought that game and both it and the bundled SiN 1 are still bound to my account and have been pulled to two seperate computers. Then there's the dramatic EA pullout for their own service. Did existing customers get screwed? No, they didn't. Their Steamwork accounts are still locked with the titles they've purchased. Games that do have limited activations when bought on Steam, when I've read the fine print, are actually setup for Steamworks to kick the counter in the head.


Of course, you are ignoring the Playstation 3 is not the most trusting console and you might not be able to run that game even if you were lucky enough to find a PS3 20 years down the line as it might not have the required security update or other software/driver patches required to run the game installed, and the servers might not exist and thus it's software DRM has locked you out. And, sadly, thanks to the fact it is a locked down system Sony is willing to try to take on the entire Internet to protect you will not be able to do anything about it without engaging in activity that is much more illegal then using a Starforce removal utility or equivalent.


You can kind of, sort of, not really argue that the console approach kind of, sort of, not really is more automated and thus not in your way as some standalone DRM solutions like Starforce. This collector line of thought however is just you deluding yourself. The current console hardware isn't like that of yesteryear it's not known for being particularly durable, and it does have an OS that like a PC OS does have software updates associated with being able to actually play a game. And you know how much Sony has shown they truly care about insuring backwards compatibility with the PS2 in their current console instead of seeing it as an opportunity to force you to either buy new hardware or rebuy the games through the PSN [sarcasm]so l can totally see why you have absolute confidence Sony wouldn't just see it as an opportunity to screw you for more money.[/sarcasm]


The reality is your claiming:


“One thing that you hear us talk a lot about is entertainment as a service. It’s an attitude that says ‘what have I done for my customers today? informs all the decisions we make, and once you get into that mindset it helps you avoid things like some of the Digital Rights Management problems that actually make your entertainment products worth less by wrapping those negatives around them.”


-Gabe Newell, Valve CEO


is the height of evil, but THE DRM company that is unique in going to the extremes of believing in setting up proprietary formats, rootkits, and that your devices don't belong to you is completely trustworthy.
 
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So you're still arguing from a "collector" standpoint but are ignoring the hardware reliability issues, and that software DRM really is not that hard to bypass, because you're more interested in your narrative then it having any relation to reality?

"Still arguing from a Collector standpoint"? well, your posts seem more argumentative, but there are lots of collectors here. I did say that it wouldn't matter if you didn't have that mindset, but you're choosing to ignore any qualification or concession I make in my comments to pursue your own narrative! I haven't said PC DRM is un-bypassable. I didn't single out Steam. The observation I originally made in response to the thread starter stands - that there was a point in favour of the games on one of the two platforms they were comparing. A point in favour I've been at pains to add is not applicable to the broader gaming community.


The 'reality' I've clearly been failing to convey is that on a PS3, (as on other consoles, but the OP has a PS3 so here we are) 'ownership' of a game is tied up in the disc itself, the DRM is the console's arena. Assuming you have a functional console, the games work offline, and can be traded, sold, loaned - collected. This is one reason there's still a thriving market for rental and used console games, but PC games is a minefield mainstream outlets prefer to avoid.


"Hardware reliability issues"?


The OP has a PS3, today. Today. He already has one. Too late to worry. My humble opinion was based on his opening question, and this fact. If hardware reliability is such a concern, maybe he should be advised to quit buying games for it at all in case it dies at some point in the future, and for some reason working PS3s become extinct and unserviceable, possibly a first for any games platform? Maybe we should start stockpiling them ourselves - we'll make a killing in 20 years!


Lots of us here have hardware 20 years of age and (far) beyond, some of it considered less reliable than current tech even when it was new!


If there's a demand, someone will meet it, or go mad trying.


"Not that hard to bypass" vs No need to bypass.


I have a friend with an XBox 360. He's never used it online, had it for 3 years. If he gets a game and doesn't like it, he doesn't need to do anything to trade it in, sell it on or loan it to someone else.


He also has a PS3, had some updates from coverdiscs. This has no bearing on the games he has - he can loan them, sell them, use them on another PS3 without any 3rd party authentication, or need to transfer it. That difference is pleasing to the collector mindset, of which there are a few here.


If he'd asked me the same question as the OP, I 'd have pointed out the same distinction. He probably would have saved a bit of money too, as he bought GTAIV for his PC and got hacked off with it's authentication business and bought it on the 360 instead.


If you're basically 'done' with a game once you've had your fill, it won't matter at all. Both classes of gamer exist in abundance. I know people who treat their games discs with contempt and think it's normal for a game to be reduced to an unreadable scratched messed up coaster within months. They just shrug and buy a new game while I look on in horror and make sure they know they can never borrow any of my games.


All this isn't a slur on Steam.

GOG.com's service won't render it moot until they sell current non-DRM titles
Witcher 2 and as I said GOG is shifting toward stocking new games as well.

"Shifting towards" is not today, and the OP was very much rooted in the present. In the run up to Christmas, I don 't imagine a lot of buyers itching to shoot someone new and unfamiliar in the face, or itching to buy a gift of the latest face shooting title for their nearest and dearest are going to defer their planned physical gaming purchases because GOG is going to be carrying their desired weapons based entertainment at some unspecified date to come. They will cross that bridge once it's fully opened, although for some the allure of physical copies in nice boxes will linger for as long as nice boxes and physical copies are made. Especially extravagant collectors boxes with disappointing extras inside, surrounded by acres of styrofoam.


This thread's opening post, since resolved, buried and given the last rites, states he has a PS3 today. Today. Itching to play new games now. Face. Shoot. In. The. Must. Now. Merits of two platforms ask did he.


His needs have been resolved, his face shooting has commenced.

Of course, you are ignoring the Playstation 3 is not the most trusting console and you might not be able to run that game even if you were lucky enough to find a PS3 20 years down the line as it might not have the required security update or other software/driver patches required to run the game installed, and the servers might not exist and thus it's software DRM has locked you out. And, sadly, thanks to the fact it is a locked down system Sony is willing to try to take on the entire Internet to protect you will not be able to do anything about it without engaging in activity that is much more illegal then using a Starforce removal utility or equivalent.

And the PC is the most trusting? Even the OS doubts it's own authenticity sometimes.


One 'might ' not be able to play a PS3 game in 20 years in exactly the same way one 'might' not be able to legitimately activate a present day physical copy PC game on the same day. A working PS3, be that a miracle or simply a well preserved, repaired or remade retro device will play a surviving disc, making it's arthritic bearded retro gamer owner very pleased with a warm self satisfied inner glow at the stress free nostalgia of it all (assuming there isn't then a loud BANG and puff of smoke).


A PC (such as they then exist) will almost certainly require some level of faffing about to get a 2011 vintage game that required activation running, even if all that means is an additional piece of software, illicit patch, archaic OS image, witchcraft or Nuclear Physics, not to mention an antiquated optical disc drive. It'll almost certainly be less painful and more convenient by then to repurchase the title ready to run from whatever online service then carries vintage face shooting titles, and that disc you've preserved all those years is a pointless shiny relic, or possibly an enjoyable technical challenge if that floats your boat.

You can kind of, sort of, not really argue that the console approach kind of, sort of, not really is more automated and thus not in your way as some standalone DRM solutions like Starforce. This collector line of thought however is just you deluding yourself. The current console hardware isn't like that of yesteryear it's not known for being particularly durable, and it does have an OS that like a PC OS does have software updates associated with being able to actually play a game. And you know how much Sony has shown they truly care about insuring backwards compatibility with the PS2 in their current console instead of seeing it as an opportunity to force you to either buy new hardware or rebuy the games through the PSN [sarcasm]so l can totally see why you have absolute confidence Sony wouldn't just see it as an opportunity to screw you for more money.[/sarcasm]

Um.. You seem to have a Bee in your bonnet about Sony. Once again, the OP's question, long since resolved, revolved around the relative merits of persisting with current titles on a system he already owned - a PS3 - vs splurging on a PC. Sony is the comparison platform because that's what the OP has not because I'm their Number 1 fanboy or anything.


A, yes, functional offline PS3 will play a software title without even being aware the internet exists. The same disc can be used on another PS3 instantly. There ended my original two cents contribution for the purposes of the original thread question.


20 years down the line I'd imagine lots of innovation will exist to maintain any old hardware that may have expired parts, just look at what's out there today for systems of 20 years ago. Which is all beyond the point though, as the whole '20 years hence' business was an obviously failed injection of humour. Being able to play 2011's top face shooter in 2031, on the same platform was not one of the OP's concerns, just one of the highly speculative, limited though not non-existent appeal, potential upsides to investing in software for one of the two platforms.

The reality is your claiming:


(Gabe Newell quote disavowing DRM)


-Gabe Newell, Valve CEO


is the height of evil, but THE DRM company that is unique in going to the extremes of believing in setting up proprietary formats, rootkits, and that your devices don't belong to you is completely trustworthy.

Um.. no, I only once referred to Steam in a joking response to your quote, even then I have repeatedly conceded this model is the way things are going. Again, the OP's question was about a PS3, that he already owns, today. This is why the Sony is the comparison platform. The first post. In this thread.


Sony's rootkits, proprietary formats, anti piracy stormtroopers, orbiting death-ray satellites and lawyers of infinite evil are of no concern while they are constrained to the evirons of a PS3. There, they do not affect the workings of my PC.


!
 
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